into + linux distro question

[zhulien]

Hi All,

I'm zhulien, long time unix shell user (at work), semi-nuby linux user (tried it about 20 times and really really persisted till now) for the last 5 years!

I've held off until now in posting to this forum as the computer club I go to lots of people (who have varying levels of linux knowledge) are very helpful, but I still need a little more help which I have found very difficult to get from faqs, google, and specific distro forums.

My questions is... no so much a direct question, but after advice and recommendations.

I have looked at lots of distros and the only two I sort of liked out of the box were Vector Linux and Puppy Linux. Mainly because although I have fast hardware I really really hate eye candy I cannot turn off - it isn't my taste.

The distro I'm presently looking at is Ubuntu 7.10, but because the out-of-box experience to me is pitiful (they have lost the plot with most distros as to what an OS is by bundling applications into it which I don't want and don't want to have to remove - it just is too time consuming).

Ubuntu so far:
- I don't like apt-get or synaptic, the idea of installing is irritating at best, I'd rather just copy a program into a folder and run it from there, seems possible with some software, but not others - this isn't the most annoying thing, and am willing to live with it if there isn't a suggested work around (I'm used to copying programs into folders and running multiple versions of the same software at the same time)

- as I want a desktop system but the desktop distro is full of junk, I've had to install the server version so I end up in a CLI which is fine. I have had to install it 'disconnected' from the internet because for some really odd reason, when connected it sucks stuff down slowing down my otherwise fast install process without giving me a choice - and I'd like an installation process I can reproduce *exactly* time and time again and *quickly as possible*.

- from the server distro (with no services installed) I then install windowmaker (cause it's fast and has the least junk of all the other GUIs). I really like windowmaker - I discovered this from my PS2 linux. not only is it fast, it does *almost* all I need.

- so far I have not found a very good file manager like Directory Opus 4.0 on Linux - roxfiler is not very nice (although fast) and I cannot remember the other ones I tried. The only one that stood out was nautilus - it works very nicely from the FULL ubuntu desktop, but is really really hard to make work *along with* windowmaker and all the nautilus plugins when using the no-frills server version.

my dilemma is given the dritros I have played (suse, lindows, ubuntu, vector, puppy, redhat long ago, debian as a server only), which would best suit MY requirements:

(from most important to least)

- must NOT have lots of applications as part of the distro by default
- must have the option of installing applications afterwards from a LARGE available pool
- must be as fast as windowmaker and as pretty as windowmaker (of course this is opinion, but given I like windowmaker > windows vista/mac osx etc), you can get a basic idea of what I'm after
- must have a good filemanager, preferably nautilus
- must allow local installation of software (I don't plan on downloading firefox x.x for EVERY computer I want to install/reinstall on - presently 2)
- ideally doesn't use a package manager, or at least force you to use one
- ideally no concept of users, just like puppy and every other single user OS (and no need to try argue the need to have multi-users on a single-user computer that most likely won't be running with a direct connection to the net, or as a server)

Any recommendations?

btw, why do all the main linux distros bundle so much into the OS anyway?

thanks, Julian

[techieMoe]

From what I gather is you want a distribution that doesn't assume anything at all and lets you configure absolutely everything from scratch. There are two distributions that come to mind: Gentoo and Slackware.

Gentoo will not install anything but the absolute bare bones kernel and text operating environment and lets you figure out what you want to add on from there.

Slackware installs more stuff from the get-go but it does assume you're going to configure everything yourself. It has no real package manager to speak of.

There's also a non-distro called Linux from Scratch, which is more like a How-To on making your own than a distro itself.

[oz]

There is also Rock Linux:

Main Page - RockWiki

[zhulien]

thanks, I will check out gentoo, although I was semi-keen on ubuntu due to the number of precompiled packages that can be easiliy installed afterwards (although I'd prefer manually copying to a folder, seems synaptic has the option of download only). I did actually check out linux from scratch but that's too low level, I just want an off the shelf-type linux OS (ie: the OS, not the rest). Unfortunately as mentioned most distros have lost the plot like OSX and Windows Vista. (my Mac Mini has OSX and it's full of junk - but I don't use Vista, cause it's too slow). I'll check out slackware and rock linux too (hopefully gentoo and slackware aren't too low level).

[zhulien]

I've downloaded ArchLinux - it sounds good, oddly thought the docs mention 3 distros of it but there are only 2 available - the full one (which would have been my preference as I want a distro that does not require an internet connection to install) is not available. Anyway, I've got the next biggest one and will give it a whirl probably on the weekend.

Rock Linux is still downloading, it's the slowest torrent in the World! This in principle though sounds like the ultimate distro (if you discount Linux from Scratch which is even lower level, not really a distro?).

I did download the latest Vector and will probably give that a whirl on the weekend also.

thanks for your suggestions.