Could Someone Explain this to me? (MS/Linux Lawsuits)

[TheAlmightyOS]

I read an article about Microsoft suing Tom-Tom because they used a Linux kernel. (see article HERE)
Then I stopped and read it again just to be sure I didn't misunderstand what was on the page.
Then I read it again to make sure my mind was not playing tricks on me.

How can Microsoft actually sue someone for using their competitors software? They can't possibly have a case, can they? Or do I need to up the dose on my caffeine intake this morning to jump start my brain? I just feel like I am missing something here.

EDIT>> OK, now I know I read it right. Just found another article from "The Register" that explains it better (see article HERE)

[bigtomrodney]

The issue isn't that it's using the Linux Kernel, it's that as they see it TomTom are violating their patents. In some of the cases this is because they believe that their patents are violated by the Linux kernel.

Though they deny it, I'd say Microsoft are glad to finally get to sue 'Linux' for something, even if it's another company. There's no point in suing where's there's no profit and as it is TomTom are quite successful so would make a good target for this sort of suit.

[Bemk]

I've seen it on the news. amazing they have time to do that, because yesterday a plane crashed, about 500 meters before the runway in Amsterdam.

I really wonder what Microsoft thinks it's doing. Is it even possible to patent a piece of code? I can imagine that you want to patent an interface, that's normal, but to patent a piece of code or a way of doing things? What the heck!

By the way, would Tomtom have to follow the American laws, or does it only have to stick to Dutch laws, because it's a Dutch company?

[D-cat]

Actually, in Microsoft's start-up days, they were buying up Operating Systems. (MS-DOS is an evolution of QDOS, and the original MS Windows came from Xerox.) One of the OS's they bought the license to was Minux.

Since Linux is an open-sourced clone of Unix, where Minux has its same roots, and the boot code in the Linux kernel has very close similarities (as is probably required to boot an Intel PC) to that of the Minux Kernel, MS believes that Linux is literally a pirate version of code they own.

Never mind that Linus Torvalds has never seen MS owned code (and has refused to when he was given a chance by MS to prove the similarities to him, a smart move IMO since he can still make the claim he hasn't seen the code) and thus MS could never prove intent to pirate (in the US, there's no crime without intent; with no crime, MS is owed no damages), MS still feels they have the right to sue anyone who uses Linux, at least commercially.

While MS is seen as the great evil empire, keep in mind that they are an American Corporation, and therefore work solely for the shareholders' bottom line. They, as any corporation operating on US soil, have a legal obligation to lack conscience in their decisions, therefore a direct legal conflict between Linux and Microsoft is inevitable. Personally, I'd like to see MS fail to prove intent and have this whole thing drop in favor of Tom Tom (and therefore Linux). It has to be done sooner or later, I would hope this puts the conflict to rest (but I know it wont).

BTW: In any country (or even province or state) that someone does business, the laws apply in that territory. MS can sue as related to sales in the USA, but that's it, they can't make claims for sales in other countries using US law, they would have to file separate suits in those other countries in accordance to those laws. Collecting awarded damages (if any) may be another matter. The most that may be enforcible would be to halt sales in the US; I'm not familiar with Dutch laws or US-Dutch treaties, so I don't know what remedies are available when it comes to that topic.

[Bemk]

While MS is seen as the great evil empire, keep in mind that they are an American Corporation, and therefore work solely for the shareholders' bottom line. They, as any corporation operating on US soil, have a legal obligation to lack conscience in their decisions, therefore a direct legal conflict between Linux and Microsoft is inevitable.

Is they referring to M$ or to Tomtom(which is Dutch)? Tomtom I suppose?

[D-cat]

Microsoft.

[GNU-Fan]

End Software Patents: Looking At Microsoft's Fat Patents Through Bilski Glasses

[Bemk]

BTW: In any country (or even province or state) that someone does business, the laws apply in that territory. MS can sue as related to sales in the USA, but that's it, they can't make claims for sales in other countries using US law, they would have to file separate suits in those other countries in accordance to those laws. Collecting awarded damages (if any) may be another matter. The most that may be enforcible would be to halt sales in the US; I'm not familiar with Dutch laws or US-Dutch treaties, so I don't know what remedies are available when it comes to that topic.

Already had a feeling this was the case, but I wasn't really sure.

I'm not sure but do US patents also hold up outside the USA? My guess is that they do, but if they don't that's in the advantage of both Tomtom and GNU/Linux. (sorry for asking so many questions, but I have to learn it somehow, I'm 16 alright)

[elija]

There are no software patents in the EU at the moment. It's up to us to lobby our MEPs to keep it that way.

[Bemk]

Ok, thanks.

I actually know of a case in which the EU sued Microsoft. It's a while ago, and if I remember correctly, MS lost the case, and a couple of million Euro. I don't know what it was about, but it's nice to see that MS loses it's cases once in a while.

By the way, Tomtoms software was originally intended for use in the EU. It has expanded and came in contact with patents, unintended, so I guess that Tomtom has a strong position here.