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you do not want there to be a way to do everything through gui. only everyday tasks and operations should be made to use the gui. other wise you end ...
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  1. #11
    Linux User benjamin20's Avatar
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    you do not want there to be a way to do everything through gui. only everyday tasks and operations should be made to use the gui. other wise you end up with a bnch of people that are compleatly dependant are complicated graphic options. then if there graphic driver screws up or something bad hapens to the system that you have a mess of problems where nobody knows how to fix there systems.
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  2. #12
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    There is a huge difference between Microsoft & Linux when it comes to proprietary drivers and hardware detection. Most hardware manufacturers build their products to work with Windows during the manufacturing process (not the result of begging for hardware specs after the fact - like Linux has to do) and they usually test their components on Windows machines along the way. Result is products ship with drivers that will work out of the box for Windows ... but not for Linux.

    As far as commandline goes ... A GUI is usually only programmed for what the average user may want to do at a given time, and will probably always lack the power and flexibility that commandline bring's to the table. But as long as it's in there somewhere, i don't mind GUI's or with them becoming more newbie friendly.

  3. #13
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    me 2 cents, if linux becomes too user friendy, it will just become too much like windows, we would be lead around like dogs on chains... crude but i couldnt find another way to say it...

    Right now, I don't feel we are getting this from Linux and many are put off trying Linux because they know that getting their first Linux up and running may be a time-consuming and tiring process.
    trying to get windows bug free is the same

    joke joke, just dont hit me...
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  4. #14
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    I understand that many in this forum are very good at command line but there are some newbies, like myself, who find it too difficult, complicated or downright horrendous. I had and still have the same problem with MS DOS command line. Maybe it's a knack you either have or don't but I feel that if Linux is ever to give Microsoft a run for it's money, then we need to have O.S. that are completely user-friendly and have easy-to-understand tools/control centres to help you analyse and correct faults/problems.
    The error in your assumption is that you think Linux is meant for the same users as Windows is, it's not, Linux is for people who enjoy taking on a challenge with the computer and solve the problems by tweaking it.
    Linux is not meant to be user-friendly.

  5. #15
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    I always like to think of Linux as an OS for power users - people who know they can have more control over their box, and want that also.

    Also, I've worked a while on an IT helpdesk, we had the guys from IT coming over if we had a problem, and guess what, for more complicated operations - they used the windows command line (or what's left of it). Furthermore, the Windows XP recovery console is almost strictly command line (I frequently find myself trying to use Linux commands in Xp) LOL.
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  6. #16
    Linux Guru bigtomrodney's Avatar
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    I understand the sentiments expressed here, but remember that linux is still making the transition to desktop from the server market. I think there has been husge strides in this direction over the last year especially, with great things on the way.

    I think though it is important to remember, it's really only a trade off - Sure Windows will work out of the box but you'll spend a lot of time later cleaning it and keeping it running, even reinstalling it. On the other hand with Linux you may spend some time configuring it at the start, but once it's up it will never need tweaking again. No reboots, no defrag, virtually no virus cleaning. I find no need to run routine maintenance other than an occasional rootkit search, and that's only for piece of mind. You just need to decide which is worth more.

  7. #17
    Linux Guru fingal's Avatar
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    This is a tough one because I'm never sure what is meant by 'user friendly'. I think that people use computers in different ways - Ask a group of people to complete the same task on a PC, and they'll approach it from different angles.

    I must admit, I really like using the command line. I think you're right in one way... If you don't like the command line, a gui won't always be the best way to sort out a problem, leaving you feeling stuck. I don't know the answer

    From a very personal point of view (which might change in the next few months) I've stopped experimenting with distros and I want to try to learn some other things - Programming etc. It's a big project!
    I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. - Pablo Picasso

  8. #18
    Linux Engineer d38dm8nw81k1ng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgoth
    I understand that many in this forum are very good at command line but there are some newbies, like myself, who find it too difficult, complicated or downright horrendous. I had and still have the same problem with MS DOS command line. Maybe it's a knack you either have or don't but I feel that if Linux is ever to give Microsoft a run for it's money, then we need to have O.S. that are completely user-friendly and have easy-to-understand tools/control centres to help you analyse and correct faults/problems.
    The error in your assumption is that you think Linux is meant for the same users as Windows is, it's not, Linux is for people who enjoy taking on a challenge with the computer and solve the problems by tweaking it.
    Linux is not meant to be user-friendly.
    i have to disagree, i find linux to be more user-friendly than windows. i can honestly say that the windows command-line is terrible and that the linux command line can be much easier and faster than using the windows GUI.
    Here's why Linux is easier than Windows:
    Package Managers! Apt-Get and Portage (among others) allow users to install programs MUCH easier than Windows can.
    Hardware Drivers. In SuSE, ALL the hardware is detected and installed automatically! How is this harder than Windows' constant disc changing and rebooting?

  9. #19
    Linux Guru fingal's Avatar
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    i have to disagree, i find linux to be more user-friendly than windows. i can honestly say that the windows command-line is terrible and that the linux command line can be much easier and faster than using the windows GUI.
    Something I've noticed in the Linux world (and this is just an observation). There seem to be a lot of 'either or' discussions. Eg:

    Gooeys v. command line
    Vim v. Emacs
    SuSe or Mandriva
    Linux v. Windows ...
    Tea v. coffee

    Personally, I use the gui and the command line to solve a problem, switching between the two. Does anyone else do this, or am I the Lone Ranger? Variety is the spice of life!
    I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. - Pablo Picasso

  10. #20
    Linux User zba78's Avatar
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    This is an issue that has been discussed thousands of time before. In general I agree with you that for linux to appeal to the general masses it will need to have GUI config tools, wizards, plug-n-play type support etc. and in this regards I believe SuSE and Mandrake have made great strides.

    The dilemma is something that we in the linux community will have to face sooner or later. On the one hand the absolute configurability and freedom-to-fiddle that we currently have, but the fact that this can turn off many non IT Literate computer users. Or have all of the bells-and-whistles that will attract the novice users, but forego some speed, tweaking and some simplicity that many linux users love.

    For me though one of the most wonderful thing about Linux is the fact that all of these things can co-exist. SuSE, mandriva etc. can continue on the path they have chosen and do what they do so well, while Slackware, debian, Gentoo etc. can continue on there path. Leaving the user the CHOICE to chose what suits them the best.

    And after all, for me, it is the freedom to choose that make Linux so wonderful.
    Ubuntu Jaunty :: Arch Linux (current) :: Acer Aspire 1692WMLi

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