Please read this post with an open mind...

[CodeRoot]

The intended purpose of this post is to raise awareness to a very important issue...

It is not intended to create any problems...

It is not intended to cause any flames...

It is not intended to insult anyone...



I just want to make an attempt at opening your eyes so you will realize what you are throwing away...



On occasion, I see (in a post) the appearance of someone - who does not yet have a sufficient grasp of English language and grammar - "not quite getting it right" in a few places. If they appear to be honestly trying -- "hey, no big deal..." -- I have a healthy amount of knowledge and understanding and patience and tolerance and ...

It is another thing altogether when people who do know good English language and grammar obliterate it while confusing the communication and the conversation...

How easy would it be for those who are sincere - but struggling - to have contempt for those who know better but don't care?

It is usually real easy to distinguish those who care from those who do not... When someone purposely "destroys the language" when they post --- I purposely consider them to be childish and immature. There have been times - when it was especially bad - that I purposely didn't bother to answer the post when I knew the answer to the question being asked. Why would I do this????? ----- Why should I not do this? --- I cannot afford to waste my time deciphering the indistinct babbling of an idiot...

I am quite sure that I am not the only member of these forums who is "more than willing" to help someone ---> who is willing to ask a "plain and simple, straight-forward" question (in a way that shows that they are serious about needing/wanting the help) ---> in "plain and simple, straight-forward" English (to convey more efficiently the concept and meaning of the question) ===> If you really are in serious need of help, wouldn't you want to "help the helper" - as much as possible - give you a fast and correct answer? Think about it...

It pays to know when to speak/write intelligently...

If you must lower yourself to "leet speak" (or other forms of drool) - please do it on IRC (not that mature, intelligent people want to deal with it there, either) - not in your posts on the forums (where a long lasting impression will be stored for all the world to see).

Those of you who think it is "cute" (or whatever) to communicate poorly in your posts --- you are doing a great disservice to these forums and its members - not to mention, the whole Linux community...

If you really, really, really, really want to give others the most positive impression possible - of these forums, and of Linux, and of the people who associate themselves with these forums and Linux -- you ABSOLUTELY MUST learn to post in good English.

These forums are intended to be a medium of exchange of ideas/etc. for the purpose of helping people get the most out of Linux. Yes, and to encourage a sense of community. Yes, and to have some fun while we are at it... Yes, the community aspect of these forums is very important. But, there is no requirement that we destroy the effectiveness of the main means of communication through the medium - we can accomplish 'community' just fine (better even) with good English.

Also, the more you purposely practice bad English, the more likely it will find its way into other parts of your life (without you realizing it, and where you really don't want it) and rob you of things you want --- you will wonder why you were passed over on that good job - you will wonder why [the one you thought was perfect] wouldn't give you the time of day - you will wonder why you were ignored when you had such good ideas --- while not realizing that your bad English was recognized by those on whom you must depend to obtain that which you desire ----- Welcome to the real world -- where major decisions that affect YOUR life are made in a moment by people who don't think you are intelligent enough --- because of your bad English...

It pays to know when to speak/write intelligently...

Do you know when to speak/write intelligently... ???

Those who know ---- will tell you the answer is: ALWAYS

Think about it...

[d38dm8nw81k1ng]

you will wonder why [the one you thought was perfect] wouldn't give you the time of day (snip) ----- Welcome to the real world -- where major decisions that affect YOUR life are made in a moment by people who don't think you are intelligent enough --- because of your bad English...

hey, where i live, the good looking ones passover the intelligent ones... >.>

[fingal]

hey, where i live, the good looking ones passover the intelligent ones... >.>

Temporarily ... Paris Hilton looks nice on occasions, but she can't find a (long term) boyfriend to save her life.

CodeRoot is quite right in my view. I often pass over posts which use bad English because I value well chosen words, and I'm very well aware that people will read my posts.

In any case, it's hard to understand what someone means if their grasp of English is poor. I also believe that hackerism demands a good grasp of language ... It's about precision, beauty and self expression. If these things are missing then so is a large part of your life, no matter what language you speak.

[ImNeat]

I understand where CodeRoot is coming from - but this isn't an issue that I have ever lost sleep over. If someone wants to post a question on here with "u" instead of "you" or "r" instead of "are" - by all means I believe he/she has the right to do so. That type of writing isn't my style, but that doesn't mean it's wrong. In the grammatical world leetspeak is often considered a dialect - as is ebonics. Now I don't speak leetspeak or ebonics - and I don't particularly care for them - but I will never refuse help to someone who does.
If that post was meant as a suggestion then I completely agree, but if it was intended to supply the "one right way to make a post" then I disagree entirely. We all have our pet peeves, but I feel we should overlook them and be tolerable. I'm confident everyone here wants nothing more than to learn some *nux =)

[Krendoshazin]

I agree *points to his signature*

[burnit]

Well, my english is not very good. Infact it is not my mother language.

What I've understood of your post is "if you want to post, post in correct english language". Correct me if I'm wrong. My opinion is: "post as best you can and make you understand".

For example I'm italian, and I don't know so much english words: so may happen I invent words, I hide subjects (because in italian language happens very frequently), and try very different phrases to reach my target: ask questions and give answers.
My approach is to understand what kind of problem an user is facing. So I can help him, even if he hasn't explained it correctly.

The key word is: comprension (invented! from italian "comprensione").

I think this language wich we (all of us) are using is not english. It's only based on it. It looks like a parallel language, built from us. It may vary (invented! from italian "variare") day by day, depending of what we write and read.

I think this should the spirit. If you are irritated (invented! from italian "irritato") because some mistake (or bad invented words ), maybe you're missing your target (or mission? or aim? boh!).

Because we are coming from all around the world, we should undestand each other (and now I'm showing my best! ). Think about it.

[Dapper Dan]

That type of writing isn't my style, but that doesn't mean it's wrong. In the grammatical world leetspeak is often considered a dialect - as is ebonics.

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree more. "Leet" speak and "ebonics" are invented subclassifications of the English language that attempt to bestow legitimacy upon what is rightly identified as sloven grammatical practice.

[gtmtnbiker98]

How about those that speak or shall I say write in English as a second language? Shall we ignore these posts for their lack of proper grammar/spelling just because English isn't their native tongue?

[techieMoe]

How about those that speak or shall I say write in English as a second language? Shall we ignore these posts for their lack of proper grammar/spelling just because English isn't their native tongue?

If you re-read the original post by CodeRoot, you'll note (and I agree with him on this) that he points out it's usually quite obvious when someone is still learning English. There's a big difference in my mind between those who are trying and still don't quite get it and those who have been raised around it and chosen their ignorance.

[Dapper Dan]

There's a big difference in my mind between those who are trying and still don't quite get it and those who have been raised around it and chosen their ignorance.

Well said techieMoe. I've seen posts by users from non-English speaking countries that are easier to decipher than some from the U.S. where the author simply chooses to use poor grammar.