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First off I am new so hi! Second off I love Linux and while not standing among the great power users I do just fine with ubuntu (laptop) and fedora ...
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  1. #1
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    Why I use Windows more then Linux and an idea for a solution


    First off I am new so hi! Second off I love Linux and while not standing among the great power users I do just fine with ubuntu (laptop) and fedora (desktop). However regardless of how much I love linux I rarely use it and the reason being is the games. Sure their are id's offerings and the ever popular Unreal Tourny Series (I own 2k4) but I trend to play mods and especialy *FREE* standalone games.

    So as I have been reading up on the history of computers and also about the net with thoughts of another book in my library about Unix I looked at the reasons Linux isn't popular among your average user.

    #1 Is ease of use and while each distribution is different aside from installing 3d drivers for my 9800 pro there is little trouble installing the system. (In fact I had less errors then when I do a windows installation) The same went for my laptop except for the 855 resolution (I had an easy time doing it however for the less nerdy amongst computer users it is a hindrence) Which is a drastic change from the older versions so this no longer a large problem.

    #2 Would be applications and I have to say apt-get and also yum are lovely little ways to update which beat windows update once correctly configured. Ontop of this you have a large set of software that is free allowing you to do most anything except for games. See this is where my problem (along with many others) starts. Sure you can use wine and its offsprings *BUT* you still can't use the source engine to any real extent (15fps is not playable) along with most dx9 games.

    And along with a few I know who find it pointless to boot one os only to switch over to another to game linux is rarely touched. So I began to wonder if people dump so much time and effort into distro's, applications, and other odds and ends why hasn't anyone made an open source engine? True it would be a huge undertaking with multiple questions to answer before anyone could do anything and the fruits of such labor would take over a year before bearing. But again why not?

    There are standalone games on linux, but no definite engine. It is true that for such an engine to become popular it would need to be portable to windows without too much effort thus allowing for a large player base but it would still help linux in the long run.

    Now for the reason I say this, Microsoft goes and gives people free things or at a lower cost even if it loses money on the endeavor. For histories sake Mcafe did the samething and the reason? Because people become/became accustom to the look and feel of the software and thus loyalty is instilled in them. Now while such an open source engine would not be profitable it would bring more users to linux especialy if at a certain point games would no longer be able to be ported. (snicker) Players who enjoyed such games would be forced to try linux to contiune to play the games they love.

    There is much more I would write but at this point I'd love to hear some feedback as to whether or not this would be a worthy project to pursue. Sadly I am not a qualified programmer (AP teaches Java and while I will soon be learning C++ it would be sometime before I could truly contribute) however I am willing to do the other parts *IF* there were enough interest.

  2. #2
    Linux Engineer d38dm8nw81k1ng's Avatar
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    Re: Why I use Windows more then Linux and an idea for a solution

    Quote Originally Posted by YenningComity
    Now while such an open source engine would not be profitable it would bring more users to linux especialy if at a certain point games would no longer be able to be ported. (snicker) Players who enjoyed such games would be forced to try linux to contiune to play the games they love.
    uh oh... you might want to delete this part before the anti-zealots get here...

    i like your thinking but the problem is the portability. windows was designed from the ground up to be non-portable and this is the reason that even wine sucks for gaming.

    what i would like to see is more companies willing to port their games over and possibly even advertise this on the box. it will also help 'swaying' users into taking the "leap of faith". even if companies weren't willing to port their software over themselves they could look into giving the code to the open source community for developing a version for linux. this would mean, however, that more companies would have to supply CD Keys with their games to combat piracy (as in the case of UT and NWN) but most people won't mind.
    Here's why Linux is easier than Windows:
    Package Managers! Apt-Get and Portage (among others) allow users to install programs MUCH easier than Windows can.
    Hardware Drivers. In SuSE, ALL the hardware is detected and installed automatically! How is this harder than Windows' constant disc changing and rebooting?

  3. #3
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    You know what? When it comes to games, I never use linux. And I don't want to mess around with the (ATI) 3D drivers - too much headache for me, I've tried to install them lots of times. Furthermore, playing native Windows games on Linux will always result in less performance.

    Linux is not meant for Windows games. I use Windows - yes I do, as lots of people here. But I don't have any critical apps that make me stick with Windows -except for my games. I don't mind commercial games being incompatible with Linux - it's still closed source software mostly, and thus not adherent to the OSS philosophy.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by borromini
    ...Furthermore, playing native Windows games on Linux will always result in less performance.
    i don't play many games anymore; however, I have found that using wine or cedega many windows games that I play are significantly faster under linux...I personally use nvidia though and not ati, I don't know if that makes much of a difference or not; however, it may, due to the difficulty of getting ati drivers to work properly under linux.
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  5. #5
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    K, my bad Seemed logical to me running an app not designed for your OS degrades performance, no?
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  6. #6
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    it seems really illogical to me as well, and in many cases wine is a ***** to work; however, since it is not an emulator and since linux is much faster with a non bloat system, I think that that gives it the edge...at least in a few cases...I don't play very many games
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  7. #7
    Linux Guru techieMoe's Avatar
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    Re: Why I use Windows more then Linux and an idea for a solution

    Quote Originally Posted by YenningComity
    ...I love linux I rarely use it and the reason being is the games.
    There's nothing wrong with using the OS that fits your needs. If your needs include playing lots of commercial computer games, MS Windows is a very good system for that purpose. Many of us dual-boot for that very reason.

    So as I have been reading up on the history of computers and also about the net with thoughts of another book in my library about Unix I looked at the reasons Linux isn't popular among your average user.
    Be careful with statements like this on a Linux forum. Many of us don't give a flying rat's anus whether or not Linux is "popular among your average user," because a lot of us see the average user as a moron, therefore want them to stay FAR FAR AWAY from our chosen operating system.

    #1 Is ease of use and while each distribution is different aside from installing 3d drivers for my 9800 pro there is little trouble installing the system.
    This is not Linux's fault. This is ATI's fault. Nvidia has wonderful, functional Linux drivers. There is no reason that ATI should not run beautifully on Linux except for ATI being lazy.

    Sure you can use wine and its offsprings *BUT* you still can't use the source engine to any real extent (15fps is not playable) along with most dx9 games.
    I don't quite follow you. DirectX is a Microsoft proprietary 3D library that is closed-source. The only way to use DirectX is to license it through Microsoft, and it only works on Microsoft Windows operating systems. WINE is a patch job at best; it's not meant to replace another OS.

    why hasn't anyone made an open source engine?
    Many people have. Cube, Dark Places, Eternal Lands, Genecys, and Graal are just a few of them. Look at The Linux Game Tome for hundreds more. That's not to mention the commercial engines that have been open-sourced such as the original Doom and Quake engines, as well as Duke Nukem 3D.

    There are standalone games on linux, but no definite engine.
    Are you saying there is one "definite engine" for MS Windows games? If so you're sadly mistaken. Although many games license other engines (Quake 3 engine for example), many many other games use their own proprietary engine with every individual game. There's nothing stopping these companies from NOT using DirectX either, other than Microsoft that is.

    Now for the reason I say this, Microsoft goes and gives people free things or at a lower cost even if it loses money on the endeavor.
    How much lower cost can you get than FREE? The Linux and Open-Source community offers all that Microsoft "gives" and more, but doesn't ask for anything in return.

    Now while such an open source engine would not be profitable...
    Most open-source software is not about profit. This may be hard to understand, but some major OSS projects such as Debian are actually AGAINST big business. The GPL license was created with the purpose of eliminating closed-source software all together.
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  8. #8
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    Couldn't have explained it better, techiemoe... Or I should have read the opening post 5 times
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  9. #9
    Linux Newbie ThoughtVelocity's Avatar
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    There's nothing wrong with using the OS that fits your needs...
    I still don't understand why people play games on windows anyway. Why not just xbox or playstation? That's what they are designed specifically to do. I think the "game thing" being a reason to stay with windows is weak but that's just my 2 cents.
    "If you are out to describe the truth leave elegance to the tailor."
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtVelocity
    There's nothing wrong with using the OS that fits your needs...
    I still don't understand why people play games on windows anyway. Why not just xbox or playstation? That's what they are designed specifically to do. I think the "game thing" being a reason to stay with windows is weak but that's just my 2 cents.
    How are you gonna play RTS or strategy games like Stronghold 2 on an Xbox? Are you gonna put out a controller with 20 buttons, to cover all the functions? It just isn't fit for it. Some games play better on pc, some better on consoles.
    ** Registered Linux User # 393717 and proud of it ** Check out www.zenwalk.org
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