LBA or CHS on a 40GB hard disk?(kinda windows question)

[rohitsz]

Greetings there,

i am trying to install linux for some time now. and am faced with new problem. i tried installing linux on my hard disk until it gave me errors posted here. i googled a little and got a site called 48bitlba.com . It says windows 98 can not support above 137G.as i am having win98, with 40G data would that put data managed by windows partition at risk?
i do not know the effects of turning on lba mode on the data managed by windows on a 40G disk. also if i install linux on CHS type disk what are the consequences with respect to data, i do not seem to upgrade hard disk in the near future! so assume 2x40G seagate hard disks.
there are third party free/share able tools available but i would want linux to do it!
kindly suggest some solution and or ways how to overcome this problem.

thanks,
rohit.

[Nerderello]

Fedora does have some problems with certain partitions (have a look at my response here :-
http://www.linuxforums.org/forum/top...tml&highlight=
)

As far as I can see, from your two posts, you want to end up with hard disk 1 (/dev/hda) having your Windows 98 and hard disk 2 (/dev/hdb) having three partitions (/dev/hda1 as about 20gb Linux partition, /dev/hda2 as about two times the amount of RAM that your PC has as a SWAP partition, and the remainder as a partiton for both Linux and Windows 98, which will mean that it will have to be formatted as a FAT partition, otherwise Windows will be unable to see it).

If this is so, then you should use the disk druid which is the graphical partition thing in the Fedora instal , to create them (you will have to do this manually, do not go fo the automatic partition option). Ignore any warning messages (that's all they are WARNINGS, not errors.).

You should, I suggest, put the boot loader, grub, on the master boor record (mbr) of your first (Windows 98 ) hard disk (I'm assuming that this is the hard disk that yoiu boot from). The rest of Grub (including the configuration file /boot/grub/grub.conf ) will be put on your Linux partition.

As to accessing data, Linux will happily access both Linux (ext2 and ext3) filesystems as well as Windows (FAT), but (no surprise here) Windows 98 will not touch anything but FAT partitions (I believe that there is a frre download that will allow you to read (but not write) to a Linux partition from Windows 98.

As to your Windows 98 problems, sorry can't help you there, suggest you find a Windows 98 forum.

have fun

Nerderello

[rohitsz]

Greetings there,
i did go thru you reply posted previoisly as you mentioned...
this is what i'll be doing! to ensure that the warning's i am getting are real or not!

first i would try running knoppix and see the out put of ....

fdisk -l /dev/hda
sfdisk -l /dev/hda

for both of my hard disks and then if there is a difference in the hard disk, will try the kernal editing option and then later either the /proc/ide/hda/settings method or sfdisk method for making the changes permanent.

i guess you rightly summarize what i exactly want out of my system...

one more thing i would like to point is i had fc3 installed previously with 98/xp and during that install i did not get these warnings... though during the system re-vamp.. i did swap the master-slave combination that i had previously .. so i wonder would doing this may make the bios revert back to CHS from LBA?

also i checked out intels site for my bios info and found out that i have a P10 patch of the bios, which came installed with the system(no flashing done yet), while th P8 patch supports the LBA mode. so i am assuming LBA mode supported by my bios. and will check and see whether LBA and other modes exist on my bios... i hope they would!

also searching for effects of LBA mode on FAT32 or anyother filesystem with hdd less than 137GB.

thanks,
rohit.

[rohitsz]

greetings there...
i did run the fdisk and sfdisk commands thru knoppix 3.6 and here the output...

--------------------------------/dev/hda--------------------------------------------
root@ttyp0[~]# fdisk -l /dev/hda

Disk /dev/hda: 40.0 GB, 40020664320 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 4865 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1   *           1         262     2104483+   b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hda2             263        4865    36973597+   f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
/dev/hda5             263        1041     6257286    b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hda6            1042        2608    12586896    b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hda7            2609        3653     8393931    b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hda8            3654        4865     9735358+   b  W95 FAT32

root@ttyp0[~]# sfdisk -l /dev/hda

Disk /dev/hda: 4865 cylinders, 255 heads, 63 sectors/track
Units = cylinders of 8225280 bytes, blocks of 1024 bytes, counting from 0

   Device Boot Start     End   #cyls    #blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1   *      0+    261     262-   2104483+   b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hda2        262    4864    4603   36973597+   f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (768,254,63)
/dev/hda3          0       -       0          0    0  Empty
/dev/hda4          0       -       0          0    0  Empty
/dev/hda5        262+   1040     779-   6257286    b  W95 FAT32
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (16,254,63)
/dev/hda6       1041+   2607    1567-  12586896    b  W95 FAT32
                start: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (17,1,1)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (559,254,63)
/dev/hda7       2608+   3652    1045-   8393931    b  W95 FAT32
                start: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (560,1,1)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (580,254,63)
/dev/hda8       3653+   4864    1212-   9735358+   b  W95 FAT32
                start: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (581,1,1)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (768,254,63)


--------------------------------/dev/hdb--------------------------------------------
root@ttyp0[~]# fdisk -l /dev/hdb

Disk /dev/hdb: 40.0 GB, 40020664320 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 4865 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hdb1               2        4865    39070080    f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
/dev/hdb5               2        2612    20972826    b  W95 FAT32
/dev/hdb6            2613        4865    18097191    b  W95 FAT32

root@ttyp0[~]# sfdisk -l /dev/hdb

Disk /dev/hdb: 4865 cylinders, 255 heads, 63 sectors/track
Units = cylinders of 8225280 bytes, blocks of 1024 bytes, counting from 0

   Device Boot Start     End   #cyls    #blocks   Id  System
/dev/hdb1          1    4864    4864   39070080    f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (768,254,63)
/dev/hdb2          0       -       0          0    0  Empty
/dev/hdb3          0       -       0          0    0  Empty
/dev/hdb4          0       -       0          0    0  Empty
/dev/hdb5          1+   2611    2611-  20972826    b  W95 FAT32
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (563,254,63)
/dev/hdb6       2612+   4864    2253-  18097191    b  W95 FAT32
                start: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (564,1,1)
                end: (c,h,s) expected (1023,254,63) found (768,254,63)

it seems that i do have the different geometry,
also can i pass the kernel argument at runtime Knoppix to really see whether there is the necessary change!.. coz knoppix did show a partition of mine as ~700b which was about 8G. so i do need to check out the kernel parameter that i can pass to knoppix and see the changes...

also i did go thru the bios and could not find LBA mode!!!
this is what i have...

> IDE Configuration
> after selecting 1st Boot drive
> i get these...
Drive Intsalled:ST340810A
Type:AUTO(default) other options were user/ide/other ide/atapi/ide removable/none.

MAX Capacity:40023MB
/*when i choose USER, i could get following fields to change which were siabled in AUTO mode*/

Configuration Selected by BIOS/*default for AUTO*/

Multi Sector Transfer:16 Sector(modifiable)
PIO Mode: Mode4(modifiable)
Ultra DMA : Mode5(modifiable)
Cable detected: 80 conductor(greyed)

i get the same settings for my second hdd which happen to be ST340810A

also the fix we are talking here would be applicable to linux environment only, as i see 37G as size reported by win on each of the disks.
how can i make these changes applicable at bios level?

thanks,
rohit.

[Nerderello]

sorry Rohit, but I can't help you here. All I know on this subject, you now know.

Nerderello

[rohitsz]

Greetings there...

i have 2x40G seagate ST340810 A type drives.
the product info link at seagate
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/...st340810a.html
says:"Set CMOS hard drive setup to Auto-Detect with LBA mode enabled."

and the bios product change notification page
http://developer.intel.com/design/pc...D/D1023340.pdf
says:"Added support for 48 bit LBA mode"
while i have recently flashed my bios to P15 patch version.

My system Info from Intel Active Monitor

I N T E L (R) A C T I V E M O N I T O R

System Information Report
2/6/05 1:25:48 PM

************************************************** *************************
General Information
************************************************** *************************
Product name Genuine Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 processor based system
Board model Genuine Intel(R) D845WN system board
OS version Windows* 98 SE version 4.10 build 2222
OS memory 523,508 KB RAM

************************************************** *************************
Processor
************************************************** *************************
Processor Genuine Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 processor
Processor speed 2.00 GHz
Bus speed 400 MHz
L1 cache Data Cache 8KB, Execution Trace Cache 12K Micro-ops
L2 cache Advanced Transfer Cache 256KB
Form factor ZIF Socket
Stepping 4

************************************************** *************************
System
************************************************** *************************
Physical memory 512 MB RAM
Memory speed 133 MHz
Memory type SDRAM, Synchronous
Form factor DIMM
BIOS date 05/25/2003
BIOS size 512 KB
BIOS version P15 (HV84510A.86A.0050.P15.0305252001)

(removed report on internal like sensors/fans etc)
************************************************** *************************
End of Report
************************************************** *************************

*Third-party brands and names are the property of their respective owners.



My problem:
i am able to see the Auto-Detect option in my bios, but unable to see the LBA mode enabled.
kindly help me find the option.

thanks,
rohit.

[Nerderello]

Rohit,
from the fact that both fdisk and sfdisk show the same number of heads (255) tells me that this is not the Fedora geometry problem.

All I can suggest is that you download the hard disk fitness program from :-
http://www.hitachigst.com/hdd/technolo/dft/dft.htm

this makes a bootable diskette. You then boot from the diskette and use the program to test both of your hard disks.

sorry I can't help more

Nerderello

[rohitsz]

Greetings there...

Rohit,
from the fact that both fdisk and sfdisk show the same number of heads (255) tells me that this is not the Fedora geometry problem.

i think its the fedora bug or the kernel bug out there. i say so because today i used the SuSE 9.1 live cd and mounted my partitions and it showed the correct size of the partition!. i don know what kernel SuSE 9.1 supports(i guess its kernel 2.6). but then FC3 also based on kernel 2.6!!!

also could i ask why did you ask me to check my hdd? they both are 40G, so i did not get it!

also could you tell the value to be passed in the kernel (i PM'ed you).

[edit]
parted info from knoppix3.6/SuSE9.1

KNOPPIX 3.6

Using /dev/hda
Error: The partition table on /dev/hda is inconsistent. There are many reasons
why this might be the case. However, the most likely reason is that Linux
detected the BIOS geometry for /dev/hda incorrectly. GNU Parted suspects the
real geometry should be 4865/255/63 (not 77545/16/63). You should check with
your BIOS first, as this may not be correct. You can inform Linux by adding the
parameter hda=4865,255,63 to the command line. See the LILO or GRUB
documentation for more information. If you think Parted's suggested geometry is
correct, you may select Ignore to continue (and fix Linux later). Otherwise,
select Cancel (and fix Linux and/or the BIOS now).
Ignore/Cancel? c
Information: The operating system thinks the geometry on /dev/hda is
77545/16/63. Therefore, cylinder 1024 ends at 503.999M.

Using /dev/hdb
Warning: The partition table on /dev/hdb is inconsistent. There are many
reasons why this might be the case. Often, the reason is that Linux detected
the BIOS geometry incorrectly. However, this does not appear to be the case
here. It is safe to ignore,but ignoring may cause (fixable) problems with some
boot loaders, and may cause problems with FAT file systems. Using LBA is
recommended.
KNOPPIX 3.6
--------------
SuSE 9.1
Using /dev/hda


Error: The partition table on /dev/hda is inconsistent. There are many reasons
why this might be the case. However, the most likely reason is that Linux
detected the BIOS geometry for /dev/hda incorrectly. GNU Parted suspects the
real geometry should be 4865/255/63 (not 77545/16/63). You should check with
your BIOS first, as this may not be correct. You can inform Linux by adding the
parameter hda=4865,255,63 to the command line. See the LILO or GRUB
documentation for more information. If you think Parted's suggested geometry is
correct, you may select Ignore to continue (and fix Linux later). Otherwise,
select Cancel (and fix Linux and/or the BIOS now).

Using /dev/hdb


Warning: The partition table on /dev/hdb is inconsistent. There are many
reasons why this might be the case. Often, the reason is that Linux detected
the BIOS geometry incorrectly. However, this does not appear to be the case
here. It is safe to ignore,but ignoring may cause (fixable) problems with some
boot loaders, and may cause problems with FAT file systems. Using LBA is
recommended.

SuSE 9.1
[/edit]
thanks,
rohit.