I'm finally making the move to linux after all this time! =)

[mortagen]

Hey guys,

For ages i have wanted to move to linux, but being a windows user all my life has made it hard so i kept going back to windows. I don't like dual booting very much so i didn't go down that path which would have made the transition much easier. Instead i've finally got around to building a dedicated Linux machine!

I still want to use Windows on one of my PCs and Linux on the box i'm about to build. This will make it much easier!

I plan on using Ubuntu first for it's big community, rapid development and it overall seems good.

A few questions first though... Since i want to enjoy my linux experience as much as i can...

a) Can Ubuntu run compiz fusion and kde4 to give me nice visuals and an overall enjoyable experience?

b) Will the following PC be capable of running Ubuntu with compiz and kde very well?

My linux box specs:

Pentium D 965 3.73ghz (it's a dual core)
4x1gb memory
Geforce 6200 AGP edition 256mb memory
A large hard drive... and is this all that i need to really list?

Thanks a lot!

Regards, Mortagen

[garyalex]

Yes compiz and KDE4 will run nicely on Ubuntu, and the system you have specified should run Ubuntu very nicely... In fact I wish I had a system like that to play with Ubuntu on!

Good luck with your install and using Linux!

[i92guboj]

a) Can Ubuntu run compiz fusion and kde4

Yes. Just like any other linux, and as long as you configure it correctly (that might be harder on easier depending on the distro & hardware combo).

to give me nice visuals and an overall enjoyable experience?

That depends on what do you enjoy. Compiz will give you eye candy, kde4 is in the way as well. Neither of them will give you a consistent and productive environment. Compiz is just eye candy and nothing more, and kde4 is not ready for production environments yet. That's my view, anyway. So take it with a grain of salt.

b) Will the following PC be capable of running Ubuntu with compiz and kde very well?

Yes. Though your graphics card is not particularly good if you plan to put fireworks in your desktop. I know because I own one. It's far below the rest of the specs.

[mortagen]

Thanks for the replies!

It was the graphics card that worried me most... And i know it's not great but it still plays Doom 3 phenomenally good for the card it is... yet it won't be able to run some compiz effects? what is the recommended graphics card for compiz then?

Thanks!

Regards, Mortagen

[bigtomrodney]

Compiz is just eye candy and nothing more, and kde4 is not ready for production environments yet.

I respect your opinion on the matter but I would differ with you on it. Although there are a lot of pointless or rather extraneous effects, there is an overall benefit of having your desktop rendered with your GPU rather than the CPU. Firstly it free CPU time, secondly you will benefit from the lack of flickering. On top of that there are benefits such as window previews in application switchers and improved visual feedback. In introducing users to Linux the CUbe and Expo effects have done more to teach about workspaces than the hours of explaining and using ctrl+alt+cursor to switch. It's often just too alien when compared with what users expect to see.

I would completely agree that too often the demo videos paint it as some kind of bling and certainly a lot of the effects are for show. Compiz isn't for everyone but it certainly is more than just eye candy.

[i92guboj]

Thanks for the replies!

It was the graphics card that worried me most... And i know it's not great but it still plays Doom 3 phenomenally good for the card it is... yet it won't be able to run some compiz effects? what is the recommended graphics card for compiz then?

Thanks!

Regards, Mortagen

Oh, don't worry, that card is more than enough to run compiz and kde4. It's not the best for overall system performance, but if you you want to do is to have some fun looking at your desktop, it's fine. It should be able to run compiz very decently.

I just did that comment because the video card is lacking compared to the rest of your hardware, but you don't have to worry about that.

Just download a livecd which has compiz if you want to check first.

[mortagen]

Ahh so you're saying its uncommon to have a 6200 agp with a dual core 3.73 and 4gb ram? i getcha Yeah i know it's no quad sli but i just want it for the snazzy effects, i mean... why not?

I just thought the 6200 was enough power to push some visual effects if it can take on vista's aero... nice to know it can! it's the only part i had major doubts on, the rest i was just a bit iffy about.

I chose a nvidia card for the better driver support than ATI and the 6200 because... i like it lol

[i92guboj]

I respect your opinion on the matter but I would differ with you on it. Although there are a lot of pointless or rather extraneous effects, there is an overall benefit of having your desktop rendered with your GPU rather than the CPU. Firstly it free CPU time, secondly you will benefit from the lack of flickering. On top of that there are benefits such as window previews in application switchers and improved visual feedback. In introducing users to Linux the CUbe and Expo effects have done more to teach about workspaces than the hours of explaining and using ctrl+alt+cursor to switch. It's often just too alien when compared with what users expect to see.

I did not speak about anything like that. I just think that compiz has nothing to offer in which regards usability. It's a showcase, and experimentation laboratory, but nothing else. And, anyway, as I stated, that's just my point of view. We could argue during hours, but if you think that the cube improves the usability in any way, then we are never going to get to a gathering point (I preffer to change desktop instantly, and I don't need a silly animation in the middle).

I perfectly know the advantages of using -intelligently- your gpu rather than your cpu. It's the same that we got with udma and bus mastering years ago for ide buses. But that's besides the point if you missuse that power by adding lots of effects. In that case, it's not only not helpful for your cpu, it's even negative, since the linux drivers usually rely on cpu much more than they should, which in turn make effects affect your overall performance, even if you are using opengl via hardware.

I would completely agree that too often the demo videos paint it as some kind of bling and certainly a lot of the effects are for show. Compiz isn't for everyone but it certainly is more than just eye candy.

Actually, there's nothing new at functionality level in compiz. It's just something that puts window frames around the client areas, and let you move then in funky ways. It also offers a decent support for key bindings, but it doesn't provide anything near the functionalities of fluxbox, kwin and let alone others like fvwm. The rest: pure eye candy.

Believe it or not, I am not against eye candy. I just think that compiz is not offering anything worthy for me. Your mileage may vary (just like everyone else's).


Kde, on the other side, has a lot of potential, and a very good and solid infrastructure, it just needs to grow. I don't know at interface level, since I will probably never use a plasma desktop anyway, but there are lots of frameworks and stuff underneath that are very interesting from a technical point of view (and given enough time, that will expand to user level as well).

[Manchunian]

Hi mortagen,

Here's what I think about this. I personally agree with i92guboj. I think the 3D desktop effects have no real use at all, other than to look good. Also, I've found that some things don't work as well when you have Compiz enabled. Having said that, I appove of Compiz, but only because it helps advertise Linux. I had a student at work today who asked me about Linux and if I could help him install it because he had seen the 3D desktop on Youtube. I then pulled out a live cd (I always take one to work!) and showed him Linux working. He liked what he saw sufficiently to take it away and try installing it at home. However, I did tell him what I thought about 3D, but that doesn't matter. The point is that Compiz alerted him to the existance of Linux and the things it can do. Once he saw Linux actually working, he was impressed by the Operating System itself more than the GUI.
As for Kde4, don't install it yet. It still isn't ready on a production environment and could cause you a certain amount of grief. I don't think you'll have long to wait, though - and your patience will be well rewarded. Kde 4 looks like a very promising development indeed.

Good luck!

[bigtomrodney]

I just thought the 6200 was enough power to push some visual effects if it can take on vista's aero... nice to know it can! it's the only part i had major doubts on, the rest i was just a bit iffy about.

I ran earlier Compiz and then Beryl on a 6200 and it ran fine. The things that worked but were a lot heavier and more sluggish were those that involved shaders such as water and blur effects. They should work, but not as well. It's easy enough to turn things on and off and play around.