linux distro for a democratic school

[trumpet]

Hi,

I am very new to linux, and I have some very specific questions about choosing a distribution. I am hoping someone will be able to give me some suggestions to get me moving.

I have two situations in which i would like to use linux. I suppose ideally I will use the same distro in both situations, but that may not be possible or wise, so i am outlining my two situations separately.

Situation 1:
I am involved in setting up a democratic school, and would like to use linux for the obvious reasons of cost (democratic schools dont have much money) as well as out of principle (linux seems pretty democratic). I need a distro that can work in these circumstances:

1. Suitable for beginners, to linux and to computers - because the students will be using it. Also I am a complete beginner to linux (and not a power user of windows) tho hopefully i am going to learn lots! Basically there should be a functional desktop environment 'out of the box'. Simple is fine - if the students want to play around adding frills and effects (transparent desktop windows and the like) that's for them to sort out. What I'll be giving them is something that works - internet, word processing, media player etc.
2. Installable on a usb - i plan to have each student who wants to use a computer buy a usb stick with the linux distro installed on it, they'd then be able to use this on any computer in the school. This will also simplify things if they start messing with the installation and 'break' it - they can always just re-install it, and no one else will be inconvenienced in the slightest (except maybe the guy - me, at least at first - who has to help them re-install it)
3. Runs well on old hardware - many of the computers at the school will be donated/bought second hand and cheaply. It should run equally easily on desktops and laptops - whatever we can acquire cheaply!
4. Portable - so any student can plug their usb into any computer in the school and boot up. It should therefore run well on a variety of hardware without needing reconfiguring, installing drivers etc. Ideally it will be plug, boot, and play.
5. Can connect easily to the internet, again without extensive configuring. this will be on the school network to which all computers will be connected.
6. Will connect easily (automatically detect?) hardware connected to each computer - scanners, wacom pads, that kind of thing.
7. Will connect easily to network printers - i understand printers can be an issue in linux, if necessary i am prepared to choose carefully (and buy new if necessary) printers that will be detected and connect and print easily. I think any postscript printer should be able to do this, tho' they are more expensive (possibly money well spent)- am I right in this?
7. The school will be in japan (where i live) so at the very least there needs to be good language support, and it'd be nice if there is a japanese distribution of the distro (I am rather unclear on how computers work in different languages, forgive my ignorance, is a japanese distro of e.g. puppy the same as the english distro but with menus translated and extra text input options?).

I have been playing with puppy linux for the last week, i've got it working (I'm using it now) but some stuff has been kind of tricky (nvidia driver i managed eventually, printing is working but is not fully functional, and I've yet to suceed in getting my wacom pad to work). I am thinking that this is because its such a small distro that it lacks wide hardware support, maybe i need something a little larger with a wider hardware base to give the portability i need? It still needs to run on old computers tho.

That's quite a list of very specific requirements isnt it? Sorry to be so long-winded, but at least those requirements should narrow the choices somewhat!

Situation 2:
This is a much more general situation, so probably any beginner-friendly distro will do the job. Feel free to ignore this section if you'd rather concentrate on situation 1. I only mention this situation because in a perfect world I'd use the same school setup at home too, because this would help me learn how to do stuff which would enable me to help the students (tho' hopefully some of them will soon overtake me!).

Basically I'd also like to move away from windows to linux at home, here are my system details:

intel core2 duo, 4GB ram, 2 HDDs, gigabyte s-series motherboard ga-73pvm-s2h
dual monitors: one is flat panel 19" widescreen 1440x900/60hz 31-01kHz horiz, 56-75 Hz vert, the other is a crt.

Pretty recent setup (built last year, by a friend), so it should run anything.
What I need to do:
1. functional desktop environment (no frills or effects necessary, I'm interested in function and ease-of-use not eyecandy)
2. linux beginner-friendly
3. Japanese language support
4 wacom tablet (i tried and failed in puppy - could be user error, but it was quite tricky for a beginner)
5. I need to run wine to use one program only - a specialist drawing package with no open source equivalent, that I use at least several times per week. Other than that I am planning on trying to go open source for all my other requirements (or i can go back to windows if necessary for an occasional bit of video editing for example).
6. Dual monitors would be nice if it can be set up - this looked very tricky in puppy. Not essential tho.

I've spent about a week playing with puppy, as I say I've struggled with some stuff so maybe its not the distro for my situation(s), alternatively maybe i need to learn more about linux! I've also searched distro watch but the information is all so bewildering, i am hoping someone can comment on the above to at least narrow my choices somewhat. Then I guess i will start playing with them to experiment!

Thank you very kindly for even reading all that, and huge thanks to anyone who has some advice to offer. Rest assured you will be helping to set up a democratic school and then introduce a whole new generation to linux!

best wishes

trumpet

PS: If i've just asked the impossible and contractictory, the linux equivalent of asking for something "superlight AND superstrong" then i apologise, i'm afraid I have no idea what's possible and isnt. A week ago i didnt know you could install an OS on a usb stick, but this concept has opened up a real realm of possibilities for the school i am involved in.

[jayd512]

Hi, trumpet! Welcome to LinuxForums!

Wow... what a list! I'll see what I can do with it, starting with Situation 1.
Suggestion, Xubuntu. It's a Ubuntu installation that runs Xfce as a window manager, so it should be a good choice for slightly older gear. I believe it can run smoothly on 256 MB of RAM. Also has good hardware detection and a large repository for adding apps later. Also, as far as a wired internet connection, there shouldn't be any need for much by way of configuration. As far as the printers, you may have to play around for a little while, but that would depend on the type of printer you decide upon.
Okay then, Situation 2:
Same, for the same reasons! Also, while I can't guarantee it, I'm thinking the Ubuntu family has good multi-lingual support.

But for your Wine question, I would advise keeping a Windows partition around long enough to make sure Wine handles your drawing application efficiently.

[vickey_20]

ubuntu would be a good choice . All linux OS provide good language support , so language is not a big issue. Chose OS carefully because if something in networking goes wrong it would become a nigtmare for a novice.

[reed9]

Look here for info on supported printers under linux: OpenPrinting database - Printer Listings

Wacom and the *buntus: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Wacom

I agree that Xubuntu is probably a good choice for the school. If you have computers with less than 256 MB RAM, I really recommend upgrading to at least 256 MB if at all possible; RAM is pretty cheap.

Running on a variety of hardware, you will run into problems, no lie. There are solutions to most of the problems you will encounter though. Ubuntu has some of the best community support and documentation out there, which is one of the main reasons I would recommend it. (Well, Xubuntu for the older hardware, but almost everything is applicable regardless of whether you're using Xubuntu or Ubuntu.)

Just a note, Ubuntu 9.04 will be released soon, and seems to have a pretty noticeable performance increase. It boots faster, and feels a lot more responsive on the desktop.

[Roxoff]

7. Will connect easily to network printers - i understand printers can be an issue in linux, if necessary i am prepared to choose carefully (and buy new if necessary) printers that will be detected and connect and print easily. I think any postscript printer should be able to do this, tho' they are more expensive (possibly money well spent)- am I right in this?

Quite the opposite is true. Here's my experience. I run a shared windwos/Linux network at home. I acquired a colour laser printer as an end-of-life sell of from work. I plugged in into my home (Linux/CentOS) server, told CUPS it was there (using the web interface), and when I turned on the Linux desktops, they automatically had the printer available with zero configuration. When I purchased a new Linux Eee PC for my wife only a couple of weeks ago - exactly the same thing happened.

Cant say the same for Windwos - I still can't get the damn thing to work properly - I seem to have drivers from an earlier printer hanging around. It's a good job I don't need to print from Windwos.

My advice is to stick to reliable printer designs, avoid Lexmarks at any cost, and try to stay with HP if you want a laser printer ('cos their native drivers are excellent).

[trumpet]

thanks very much for the replies! And after all that reading too

I had a try with xubuntu a couple of months ago on my old laptop (sony viao) i couldnt get the screen to configure properly, but the same thing happened with ubuntu (even after some extensive help from the ubuntu forums) so it seems to have been a hardware issue. I'll definitely have another look at it. Also i know there is a ubuntu japanese distribution, and i know ubuntu and its variants have good support, which is likely to be important to linux newbies like me and my students.

Any thoughts on the USB install? Could I do that with xubuntu? It isnt an essential requirement i guess, but it certainly is a tempting possibility to have all the students have their own installation that they can mess with at will! Could be a really exciting learning opportunity for them (without inconveniencing other students - and staff! )in the process... Especially as USB sticks are so cheap now (i just bought 8GB for ￥１５００　－　about $15 give or take)

Alternatively, the USB idea may be a little far-fetched - certainly if it's easier I could just install xubuntu on the HDDs. Or i suppose I could install it AND give the students the option of a USB installation if they want one, if they want to move beyond internet surfing into the world of linux distros.

I'll look at adding RAM, that's certainly an interesting idea to give a little boost to older computers. And i will look again at printers, Roxoff your experience gives me hope!

thanks again for the comments, very helpful indeed. Any more thoughts on the USB issue?

[tripmix]

Yes you can run ubuntu live, I don't remember exactly how but I had a ubuntu on a usb for my eeepc so it is out there. Maybe you want to take a look here: Debian Live Project This gets a little complicated since it's debian, but the livehelper app lets you build your own live usb distro based on debian. It will help you build a debian that will do what you want. Add your school logo to the boot screen, include nvidia drivers or other non-free stuff. It would be a good project to put your students too work on, make them all build their own live-debian usb that will boot on as many machines as possible. The ones that are pre-built and can be downloaded from the site are pretty good if you just want to try it out.

[reed9]

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/In...n/FromUSBStick

[rokytnji]

Howdy and Welcome Trumpet. This is easy to use to make a bootable USB

UNetbootin - Homepage and Downloads

[blinky]

Most people have discussed the distributions. If you have a reasonable powerful machine available as a server and the client machines can boot using the lan, then use a network boot and nfsroot (NFS-Root mini-HOWTO). The server only supplies the filesystem and the applications run on the client hardware.

Also have a look at at http://www.ltsp.org/

You could a mixture of both, nfsroot (as much as possible - wher eclients have sufficient power) and terminal services for less powerful cllient hardware (the applications in the case will run on the server).

As for the printers, if they use postscript/pcl great - it should just work. Most inkjets will work just don't pick the bootom of the price range. If you have the printers shared via cups, then all machines will pick them up as a postscript printer.

Other devices such as scanners etc should work. The good thing with nfsroot, if you do it right a single image, with all the drivers your are liable to need will be available to all client machines.

Hope it makes sense, it actually harder to explain, than just to do it