The myth of lack of support for Linux from ISPs

[smolloy]

(Posted this in the Newbie forum since it seems like a trap that Newbies might fall into. If the mods think this should be moved into the Coffee Lounge, please feel free )

I live in the UK, and my broadband access if via Virgin Media. Over the past few days, I've noticed that my wireless connection was starting to switch on and off randomly, until, a few nights ago, it went completely.

My first inclination was that the wireless received in my laptop was broken, but since it could still see my neighbour's access point, I knew the problem had to be with the router Virgin had supplied me with. My next test was to plug in an ethernet cable and confirm that I still had access to the net -- which I did: the router was working, but the wireless antenna was borked.

Nice. All I had to do was explain this to Virgin, and they would send me a new router!

So I phoned them and explained what was wrong. They tried all the usual things -- "Can you switch it off, and back on?", "Is the wireless light on your laptop working?", etc. -- until they came to ask me to check the driver on my laptop.

"Which operating system are you using?"

"Ubuntu Linux."

"What?"

"Linux. It's an operating system."

"?"

"...."

"Do you have XP or Vista?"

"No."

"Hmmm..... Sorry sir. We don't support Linux. Thank you for your call!"

"Wait, what?"

This was their killer. Since I don't use XP or Vista (and notice that not even Macs are "supported"), they didn't feel the need to help me. They weren't even going to try to diagnose the problem since I don't have the "right" OS -- as far as they were concerned, they had the winning card.

The trick is not to let them away with it. I immediately interrupted (very politely) and explained that the problem was not with my laptop, and I explained why (i.e. I explained the investigations I had conducted). Also, I made sure to state that I am a very technically minded person, and that, while I understood they didn't support Linux, I didn't *need* support for Linux I tried to make him understand that all I wanted him to do is to support their *own* hardware!

After 10 minutes of discussion, I eventually persuaded the operator that the router was in fact broken, and they would send me a new one. Of course, they wanted to charge me for that, but the arguments I used to persuade him to give it to me for free aren't really the subject of this post.....

The "sorry, we don't support Linux" argument is something that a lot of us have come up against, and that we're sure to see more of in the future. It is possible to get around it, and the secret is to be firm, and to be sure you do enough investigations in advance and to know what you're talking about.

Always be polite -- "please" and "thank you" will get you a long way -- and stand your ground.

Good luck!

[rokytnji]

Windstream tried that lane of argument when the problem was a server issue on their end. They backed up when I mentioned, "My Wifes Vista and XP gear is experiencing the same problems. I sent a email to Windstream Corporate as I have been a customer for years and do I have to switch ISPs to get good service.

Problem solved in 8 hours.

[coopstah13]

All ISP's are the same with regards to these. My favorite is that they provide you with a disk to "install the internet" (and of course its windows or windows/mac only!). Fortunately these days all you need to do is call and give them the mac address so it works.

[smolloy]

I remember Virgin gave me a disc to "install my wireless" when I first signed up with them. The problem was that it wouldn't work with the 64 bit Vista installation I had ("Sorry sir, we only support 32 bit Vista.") *rolls-eyes*

Turned out, it was easier to boot into Ubuntu, and configure the router with Firefox

[Dapper Dan]

I changed ISPs a couple of years ago and had great fun with the tech guy who came to install the modem. After installing it, he grabbed the mouse, looked at the screen for about 20 seconds then said, "Where's the start menu? I said, "right there" and pointed to the IceWM "start menu" button. After he clicked on it, he roamed up and down the menu for several more seconds and said... "What the hell is this??!" At this point I couldn't help myself and burst out laughing. I told him it was Linux and then proceeded to do what was necessary to get connected. He was quite fascinated and seemed to enjoy watching the whole process.

[GNU-Fan]

It's ironic in a way. Do these support guys think that the servers your modem connects to run with Windows XP Home or Vista solely?

[grishi_111]

I changed ISPs a couple of years ago and had great fun with the tech guy who came to install the modem. After installing it, he grabbed the mouse, looked at the screen for about 20 seconds then said, "Where's the start menu? I said, "right there" and pointed to the IceWM "start menu" button. After he clicked on it, he roamed up and down the menu for several more seconds and said... "What the hell is this??!" At this point I couldn't help myself and burst out laughing. I told him it was Linux and then proceeded to do what was necessary to get connected. He was quite fascinated and seemed to enjoy watching the whole process.

i have faced the same situation.
actually i enjoyed that guy's puzzled face.
even he was surprised to say call my machine a computer. he was searching for My Network Place.

[Bemk]

When we moved our modem/router didn't work. We called about 20 times because we have VoIP phone, which also connects to this modem, and they asked us to reset the whole thing. in the end the whole problem was in the fact that the signal of the former inhabitants of that house was still on the line, while ours should have been there. A problem in the server.

Now I am experiencing trouble with the DNS, as the modem/router fails to forward the requests to the WAN side, when the DNS request is received. I now have manually configured the Linux boxes to just do the request with the ISPs DNS, but somehow the ISP always manages to put the Windows box back on the modem/router(then DNS fails). When I mail they just can't turn up an answer to my questions.

I have, however, never had my Linux habits being the excuse to not help me.
When internet connection was first installed though, the man who had to install it (my dad chose to have it that way, to prevent the need of calling an expensive helpdesk) skipped my notebook, because he couldn't get logged in (ehm, ctrl+alt+del for 10 secs, fill in Administrator with no password, and you're in, I was still running XP back then, it somehow refused to install an admin password).

[bigvoo]

yeh, in a weird twist, my isp bit hemselves on this topic...my ( isp provided ) modem went down on a friday night, and you cannot buy them in stores, I said no way i can be without internet for 2 weeks while a modem gets sent here, they said " well we understand if you buy another brand modem...BUT our tech guy will have to set it up over phone, and they close in 1 hour" 0o0... i burned rubber to frys, bought the cheapest d.s.l modem they had ( oddly it's the best modem I ever owned by far ) and got home to late to have their tech support " set it up over the phone"...sigh. so I plugged in the modem any way and just typed in my i.sp password and .....I was online....HEY I didn't have to get tehc support after all...and then went..." the only reason i still have vist on the notebook is....of course it won't work without the i.s.p software!" ......lol it works perfectly with linux mint. I understand they don't give " support" in the way of talking me through a linux meltdown....and Im fine with that, as long as m copmuters will connect that's all i need.

[daark.child]

I've had better luck with Virgin Media here in the UK. A few years ago I moved from BT to Virgin Media and the broadband setup needed a disc that only worked on Windows and Mac. I called tech support and was lucky enough to speak to someone who seemed aware of the existence of other OSes. She gave me all the details I needed to setup the connection manually and I was good to go. Recently there was a fault with our modem and an engineer came out to take a look at it. He was quite intrigued by our home network setup and he had a go at using one of our Linux desktops. He then told me that the Virgin Media modems were running an embedded version of Linux.